The Church and The Great Tribulation (Rapture Thoughts part 5)

 Photo I took a couple years ago...

I've heard it said that because the great tribulation is also called "the time of Jacob's Trouble" it means the church is not present during the great tribulation. I want to hear what the Bible says about it and see if that is indeed what the Bible tells us.

Those who hold to the pre-trib version of eschatology will say that the elect mentioned in Matthew chapter 24 cannot be Christians but must be Jews that convert to become Christians after the Church has been raptured away prior to the beginning of the great tribulation. So let's examine the word elect in the rest of the New Testament to see if it only refers to converted Jews only.

First let's look at the word "elect". The Greek word is eklektos which comes from a word meaning selected  and is by implication "favourite" or "chosen". It is used a great many times in the new testament. Jesus uses this word, and He of course spoke with Jews, and the Jews today are still referred to as "the chosen people", but does that therefore mean it exclusively refers to only Jewish people?

In Matthew 24 Jesus tells His closest disciples this when they  ask Him about the end of the age:

Matthew 24:24, 29-31  For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect....
  Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:  And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.   And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Other places that this exact same Greek word is used the Bible is directing its admonition to all believers:

 Colossians 3:12  Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

and here in this next verse, Paul who is called the apostle to the Gentiles says to Titus:

Titus 1:1  Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

Was Titus Jewish? According to Answers.com:

Where is Titus in The Bible from? 

As per Harper's Bible Dictionary (1954) pg. 765 "Titus, whose home was probably in Antioch or its neighborhood, was born of Gentile parents (Gal 2:3) and was a convert of Paul (Tit 1:4)". 

Also it is said of the saints mentioned in the book of Revelation that they are not Gentiles, but Jews that convert after the rapture because the word "church" only appears up to chapter 4 of the book. Does the Bible say that the term saints only applies to Jewish converts?

 Revelation 5:8  And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.

 Revelation 11:18  And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

 Revelation 13:7  And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

 Revelation 13:7-10  And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.   And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.   If any man have an ear, let him hear.   He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. 

In fact, in the new testament the word "saints" every reference is always to the church....but according to the pre-trib tradition it changes to mean "Jewish converts to Jesus after the rapture of the Church" after chapter 4 of the book of Revelation begins and then magically again becomes all believers including the church after Jesus returns.

This is the verse that mentions what happens at the end of the millenium:

Revelation 20:9  And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

So are the saints mentioned in Revelation 20 only Jewish converts from the tribulation period? Or is the church counted in with those saints...? and if so, why isn't the word church now so stated?

Anyway, these are some things to ponder and bring before the Lord in all honesty, wanting the truth only, not man's traditions or wishes or fears dominating one's eschatology. In Jesus we have nothing to fear because if Jesus is for us who can be against us? They can kill our bodies but not our souls. Even so, come quickly Lord Jesus.

In my next post I shall share a video that tells even more about the problems with the pre-trib position, stating it much more concisely than I have done here. I hope that you will give all these things serious consideration, having the love of the real and whole truth always as the final reason for what we believe.